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  The Buddha once taught the Bhikkhus about the All:

"I will teach you the All. Listen closely. What is the All? It is eye and visible object,
ear and sound, nose and scent, tongue and taste, body and feelings, mind and ideas.
... continue...

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→→→→ vertical line TOPIC: GOODNESS
vertical line Posted on Mar.09.2007 @ 10:45AM EDT by stephen

"Other religions would have us simply avoid evil and grasp at goodness. They have us grasp at and become attached to goodness, even including the epitome of goodness, namely God. Buddhism goes much further, condemning attachment to anything at all. This attachment to goodness is right practice at the intermediate level, but it just can't take us to the high level no matter what we do. At the lowest level we avoid evil, at the intermediate level we do our utmost to do good, while at the highest level we make the mind float high above the domination of both good and evil. The condition of attachment to the fruits of goodness is not yet complete liberation from suffering, because, while an evil person suffers in a way befitting evil persons, a good person suffers also, in a way befitting good persons. Being good, one experiences the kind of suffering appropriate to good human beings. A good celestial being experiences the suffering appropriate to celestial beings, and even a god or Brahma experiences the suffering appropriate to gods. But complete freedom from all suffering will come only when one has broken free and transcended even that which we call goodness to become an Aryian, one who has transcended the worldly condition, and ultimately to become a fully perfected individual, an Arahant."


Go to Latest Reply   Reply to this Topic   Email stephen
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Reply from -----0
Mar.09.2007
02:14PM EDT 
vertical line Is this perfect individual separated from others?
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Reply from Woodsman
Mar.09.2007
10:23PM EDT 
vertical line Others, remind us of our own vulnerability in feeling useless.
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Reply from ______
Mar.10.2007
06:03AM EDT 
vertical line Through others, the one eye of the heart that sees but cannot see itself, sees you.
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Reply from ______
Mar.10.2007
06:06AM EDT 
vertical line One, we don't see the self and IT coming.
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Reply from Woodsman
Mar.10.2007
07:43AM EDT 
vertical line Speak for yourself.
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.11.2007
09:03AM EDT 
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An inexpressible, self-arisen expanse
Without the names "samsara" and "nirvana."

Here, "self-arisen" means the primordial state. It is not something we can fully express with words or concepts. It's beyond words or concepts. The nature of all is not biased; it is not restricted to one or another. The nature of all exists in one identical state. That ground, that nature, does not have any name such as samsara or nirvana. That is the foundation, that is the ground. It is beyond samsara and nirvana. Not knowing the ground means wandering in samsara. If you recognize this ground, if you truly experience this ground, buddhahood is attained. That is the fruition. That is the result of our practice and our path.

...The ground, that fundamental state of simplicity, is the origin of all elaborations. This pure basic state is like a simple artist's canvas. We paint different images on this canvas. We can paint the image of a buddha, and it becomes very pure, beautiful, and inspiring to look at. We can also paint a devil on the same canvas, which can create our fundamental suffering, our basic pain. However, the basis of both is the same simple state of canvas that is completely pure and totally free from the images we project on it. It is totally free, whether that image is a buddha or a devil. That is the origin.

--from Penetrating Wisdom: The Aspiration of Samantabhadra by the Dzogchen Ponlop Rinpoche, published by Snow Lion Publications

With thanks,

Harry.

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Reply from 77 zen ror
Mar.13.2007
08:02PM EDT 
Email 77 zen ror
vertical line When the hearts spakes. The ears listen. To the joy what is said. PEACE out
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Reply from Lionel
Mar.14.2007
04:58AM EDT 
Email Lionel
vertical line ...thks, ...could a religion of pure awareness arising... in the 21st century...? ,,,where everyone on earth is the holy book itself & is 'free' for all anywhere anytime... CHEERS~~~
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Reply from stephen
Mar.14.2007
09:04AM EDT 
Email stephen
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From Stephen: But complete freedom from all suffering will come only when one has broken free and transcended even that which we call goodness to become an Aryian, one who has transcended the worldly condition, and ultimately to become a fully perfected individual, an Arahant."

A question from “O” “Is this perfect individual separated from others?”

 

One of many “answers”: No! Suffering is a subjective state of mind. Because I have something you do not have does not make us separate only different. If I give up the thing we are the same. An Arahant understand your suffering but is not participating. Their compassion comes from understanding not empathy. MU

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Reply from ______
Mar.14.2007
09:44AM EDT 
vertical line What do you have?  Understanding isn't necessarily compassion - to be compassionate is to suffer with the other.  There are not lots and lots of individual nirvanas, heavens, liberations, mokshas,  enlightenments as the ego imagines - just the one enlightenment in which all participate.  Our individual uniqueness shouldn't be confused with the ego's belief in its own importance and specialness - uniqueness is only experienced when the separateness of an individual has given way to indivisibility.
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Reply from stephen
Mar.14.2007
11:00AM EDT 
Email stephen
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Interesting and insightful but not Buddhism. MU

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Reply from -----0
Mar.14.2007
12:23PM EDT 
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There are several flavors of Buddhism. A common misunderstanding is that one can achieve some status above others. In such cases it is just one type of delusion that is substituted for another.

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Reply from HarryB
Mar.14.2007
12:29PM EDT 
vertical line Therevadan is vanilla

Zen is coffee

Chinese Ch'an is Rum and Raisin

Vajrayana is mint w/h choc chip

Pure land is (an imminent) chocolate sundae

'American Zen' is all of the above in no particular order or uniform quantities... but its quite pricey.

Regards,

Harry


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Reply from -----0
Mar.14.2007
12:40PM EDT 
vertical line freedom pizza
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Reply from ______
Mar.14.2007
01:08PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Interesting and insightful but not Buddhism. MU

"
.........

Even your version is acceptable within the broad church of Buddhism.
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.14.2007
01:16PM EDT 
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American Zen, sir? Wonderful choice, that'll be $89.95... would you like that sprinkled with concepts, no extra charge?

Regards,

Harry.

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Reply from Woodsman
Mar.14.2007
01:23PM EDT 
vertical line My hair is so short, I feel like a nobody. So I just came back from a 4 mile walk with the dogs. That is all.
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Reply from whatzen
Mar.14.2007
01:48PM EDT 
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vertical line I, like everyone, belong to the church of innate wisdom. All exterior decoration is a natural occurance. All code of ethics is forgiveness, compassion and common sense. The act of communion comes in each breath. Everywhere is worship with every person, place and thing. The sermon is silence and stillness in action. The minister is Love.
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Reply from -----0
Mar.14.2007
02:12PM EDT 
vertical line the sea is still frozen
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Reply from whatzen
Mar.14.2007
02:14PM EDT 
Email whatzen
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Quote: "the sea is still frozen"
.........

Dont forget global warming.

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Reply from -----0
Mar.14.2007
02:16PM EDT 
vertical line everything is global
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Reply from whatzen
Mar.14.2007
02:18PM EDT 
Email whatzen
vertical line everything appears global
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Reply from -----0
Mar.14.2007
02:21PM EDT 
vertical line everything appears
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.14.2007
02:27PM EDT 
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Are you lot really the same person, or are you all just drinking the same contaminated water?

Regards,

Harry.

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Reply from -----0
Mar.14.2007
02:31PM EDT 
vertical line just contaminating the same person
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.14.2007
02:35PM EDT 
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"Contamination is wealth".

'Dirty water', its funny that... water is never dirty. 

Regards,

Harry

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Reply from -----0
Mar.14.2007
02:42PM EDT 
vertical line it is only the dirt in it that is dirty
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Reply from ______
Mar.14.2007
03:17PM EDT 
vertical line Only the mind and bowel can polarise cause and effect.
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.14.2007
03:23PM EDT 
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Oh, must dash, I feel a good 'polarisation' coming on.

Regards,

Harry.

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Reply from HarryB
Mar.14.2007
03:29PM EDT 
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Aaahhhhhhh... so, is dirt dirty or not?

What would a fly say?

Q. What's brown and sticky?

A. A stick.

(I know, oldie but goodie)

Regards,

Harry

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Reply from whatzen
Mar.14.2007
03:36PM EDT 
Email whatzen
vertical line Quote: "

Are you lot really the same person, or are you all just drinking the same contaminated water?

Regards,

Harry.

"
.........

"
.........

Yes. If that is what you see then that is what you are looking at.

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Reply from HarryB
Mar.14.2007
03:43PM EDT 
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Dirty little Buddhas.

Regards,

Harry.

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Reply from 77 zen ror
Mar.14.2007
05:12PM EDT 
Email 77 zen ror
vertical line Well done, very well done all . RORY, Put loveing kindness back in this world. We are all one with him who ever you chose. To call your god, lord, higher power,. It's all a loving sprit, love on. RORY
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Reply from ______
Mar.15.2007
07:49AM EDT 
vertical line In reality, there is mo separating the formless from form. Some may believe that to abide in God and goodness is an attempt to avoid negativity and is a kind of attachment while advocating spiritual paths that are attached to the idea of God as a thing, a being among other beings, an idol of God. However, to abide in God is not attachment but detachment. Attachment is like standing in a river and refusing to accept the water flowing toward us and refusing to let go of the water flowing away from us. The detachment of abiding in God has nothing to do with refusing, hiding, being aloof or withdrawn, it is full on engagement and means that we stand in the river of life accepting what comes and letting go of what passes on, saying "yes" to all life.
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.15.2007
08:09AM EDT 
vertical line And yet I see rivers but no God.

Regards,

Harry.
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Reply from ______
Mar.15.2007
05:33PM EDT 
vertical line God is the next river you see, the next person you meet, the next dog you blame, no need to look any further.
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Reply from 77 zen ror
Mar.15.2007
07:44PM EDT 
Email 77 zen ror
vertical line Thank you all, RORY
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.16.2007
06:10AM EDT 
vertical line I like rivers, people, dogs... God won't be coming between me and them.

Regards,

Harry.
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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
06:25AM EDT 
vertical line There's something between you and them  but it ain't God.   There is, of course, a flaw in stephen buddhism's view of God as a thing of goodness cuz God is beyond any imagery, ideas and concepts of good and evil.  
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.16.2007
06:36AM EDT 
vertical line But not beyond a name it seems. The universe has never introduced itself to me thus.

Regards,

Harry.
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.16.2007
06:44AM EDT 
vertical line Nobody is separate from anything, by the way. There are no barriers or beginnings or ends. They are all implied. Its simply a question of relative perceptions. Everything is really quite perfect when we care to observe it.

To see barriers (certainly, to see them on the behalf of others) is a valid enough silly game I suppose though.

Regards,

Harry.
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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
07:21AM EDT 
vertical line No barriers, no betweens.  And yes, God is beyond a name - words are a means of communication and like I-thoughts need to be let go.
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.16.2007
07:39AM EDT 
vertical line The need generally seems to be more a cause of suffering than the words do...  need is a misidentification error, like God, there is no need.
 
Ever tried remembering words? I don't find it easy anyway.

Regards,

Harry.


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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
07:44AM EDT 
vertical line To know no barriers is to know no between.  Ego I-thoughts set up the barriers and is the between of you and them. 
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.16.2007
07:55AM EDT 
vertical line Look at the 'I-thoughts', see them come, see them go, see through them... no big deal. Running after something more... watch it come, watch it go, watch the need die.
Running after Buddha's enlightenment... watch it come... watch it go... watch the need die. Finding the empty heart of compassion in the essence of every perfect movement... and watching it die. Feeling the illusion of hollow emptiness slip away, seeing through it, giving it back.

People see their suffering as something that they want people to take away... have they tried just giving it away? LOOK AT IT, WHAT DOES IT FEEL LIKE JUST AS IT IS... NOW YOU HAVE IT, GIVE IT BACK YOU STINGY IDIOTS!!! You really can't hide it indefinitely.

How profound to watch a God die... and then its back to just here again and everything rinsing away beautifully, and not a single drop of harmful detergents!

Regards,

Harry.


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Reply from stephen
Mar.16.2007
10:58AM EDT 
Email stephen
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Very nice Harry! Thus pure land Buddhism. Pure water waves washing the sand of time. Subtracting old imprints, smoothing the beach of the presence and leaving fresh new traces to be enjoyed and worked with. Out with the suffering air, in with the non-suffering air. Know the water, see the beach and enjoy the rhythm. MU

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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
11:46AM EDT 
vertical line What passes the stephentest is a description of a stephenism - its only similarity to Pure Land is the ism. Pure Land Buddhism: through devotion (yes bhakti) becoming bodhisattva not arahant.
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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
11:56AM EDT 
vertical line ism ism is m aster
oi oi oi
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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
12:25PM EDT 
vertical line oooh think think think...God beyond a name...is Buddha beyond a name? Who Shakyamuni? Who Amitabha? Who Krishna? Who Jesus? Who am you? Is em beyond ism?
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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
12:28PM EDT 
vertical line thunk thunk thunk...God beyond a name...Buddha beyond a name who Shakyamuni who Amitabha who Krishna who Jesus who am you is em beyond ism
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Reply from whatzen
Mar.16.2007
01:06PM EDT 
Email whatzen
vertical line jism
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Reply from whatzen
Mar.16.2007
01:09PM EDT 
Email whatzen
vertical line whatzenism?
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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
01:19PM EDT 
vertical line ?stephen would know, he the authority on buddhismism.
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Reply from ______
Mar.16.2007
01:25PM EDT 
vertical line Similar but not the same as a bushism is a malaprobuddhistism is a wolf in cheap clothing going up and down like a metronome.
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Reply from ______
Mar.17.2007
12:54PM EDT 
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If you understand God, it ain't God. If you understand the nature of Buddha, it ain't that.

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Reply from Woodsman
Mar.17.2007
03:43PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

If you understand God, it ain't God. If you understand the nature of Buddha, it ain't that.

"
.........

Could you explain that please, and you're it.
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Reply from ______
Mar.17.2007
04:18PM EDT 
vertical line If it explains, it ain't it.
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Reply from Woodsman
Mar.17.2007
04:38PM EDT 
vertical line I was born the 2nd son in a family of five be it the youngest one.
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Reply from -----0
Mar.18.2007
04:02AM EDT 
vertical line Who Can Hear The Buddha Sing?
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Reply from amylim
Mar.18.2007
04:59AM EDT 
Email amylim
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Quote: "Who Can Hear The Buddha Sing?"
.........

Hear Not. The Buddha Understands that all Dharmas have one nature Don't  Have Any other, which is no-nature. Singing In timeless reality of Nature with Grasping

With Metta

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Reply from Lynnoh
Mar.18.2007
10:35AM EDT 
Email Lynnoh
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Quote: "Who Can Hear The Buddha Sing?"
.........

who is asking?

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Reply from Lynnoh
Mar.18.2007
10:39AM EDT 
Email Lynnoh
vertical line Who is Hafiz?
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Reply from HarryB
Mar.18.2007
12:22PM EDT 
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Pure Land, fresh and fragrant, will be next season's Manure Land, rank, rich and smelly... Nirvana is undeniably an ecclectic little dumpism.

I suppose some Isms are a valid enough game; most cause untold, unseen suffering.

Regards,

Harry.

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Reply from lehish
Mar.18.2007
01:11PM EDT 
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Quote: "Who Can Hear The Buddha Sing?"
.........

:)

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Reply from 77 zen ror
Mar.19.2007
08:03PM EDT 
Email 77 zen ror
vertical line Listen to your hearts. That is the love of Buddha with in you all. All as one. Be good to one other. LOVE RORY
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Reply from lehish
Mar.19.2007
08:17PM EDT 
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Quote: "Listen to your hearts. That is the love of Buddha with in you all. All as one. Be good to one other. LOVE RORY"
.........

:)

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Reply from -----0
Mar.21.2007
08:52AM EDT 
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Quote: "Who is Hafiz?"
.........

He is the old Friend from Shiraz, Iran. The same place where the red Shiraz wine originally comes from.

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Reply from Lynnoh
Mar.21.2007
11:35AM EDT 
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