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  Posted on Aug.08.2009 @ 10:58PM EDT by chontri
What, monks, is the world? The eye and shapes, the ear and sounds,
the nose and smells, the tongue and tastes, the body and tactile objects,
the mind and mental objects - these... continue...

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→→→→ vertical line TOPIC: SEPARATED OR INTEGRATED MEDITATION?
vertical line Posted on Oct.23.2008 @ 09:22AM EDT by zen-zen
If you do meditation, then how do you implement it?

Is it a separate practice from your other daily activities?

Or is it integrated to whatever you do so that any act is an act out of meditative emptiness?

What is your approach?
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Reply from Woodsman
Oct.23.2008
09:30AM EDT 
vertical line Most of my approach is individualistic, in that I don't use groups or prescribed ritual to separate from the world of delusion. There are meditation groups in my area, but I go on alone.  Within delusion is enlightenment, within suffering release. Nature based religions include all elements of living and dying, the living and the dead are equally real, therefore the domain of experiencing awakening is offered at all times, in all places and people.
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Reply from zen-zen
Oct.23.2008
09:41AM EDT 
vertical line Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

My own approach is integrated: meditation is not a separated activity that I would do specifically. It used to be that but then I started moving around a little and the same 'quality' still followed me.

I can tell you driving a car is sometimes quite an adventure.
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Reply from ______
Oct.23.2008
10:10AM EDT 
vertical line Thank you for not eating a hamburger.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 88291
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Reply from ______
Oct.23.2008
10:11AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Most of my approach is individualistic, in that I don't use groups or prescribed ritual to separate from the world of delusion. There are meditation groups in my area, but I go on alone.  Within delusion is enlightenment, within suffering release. Nature based religions include all elements of living and dying, the living and the dead are equally real, therefore the domain of experiencing awakening is offered at all times, in all places and people.

"
.........

Why don't you just shut up?
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Reply from sit_teh
Oct.23.2008
10:14AM EDT 
Email sit_teh
vertical line I have just came up with a creative meditation... i'll post it sometime. since it is new to me right now i'll wait. my first try at it brought me good clues that just might work..

so look for it in the next day or two..

peace
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Reply from shayne
Oct.23.2008
10:20AM EDT 
Email shayne
vertical line i dont understand seperated.
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Reply from ______
Oct.23.2008
10:28AM EDT 
vertical line I'm thinking about posting a whole lot of stuff about abouts and lies and other stuff which to the right individualistical will make me look like a complete numpty while to the right individualistical might make me look like the sage of the age. Stay tuned, it might be sooner or later than you think.
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Reply from shayne
Oct.23.2008
11:04AM EDT 
Email shayne
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Quote: "I'm thinking about posting a whole lot of stuff about abouts and lies and other stuff which to the right individualistical will make me look like a complete numpty while to the right individualistical might make me look like the sage of the age. Stay tuned, it might be sooner or later than you think."
.........

whatever rustic....have at it.

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Reply from ______
Oct.23.2008
11:10AM EDT 
vertical line Here's a truth: mediation isn't 'something you do'. Here's another: no zen on this forum. And another:
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Reply from Woodsman
Oct.23.2008
11:38AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Most of my approach is individualistic, in that I don't use groups or prescribed ritual to separate from the world of delusion. There are meditation groups in my area, but I go on alone.  Within delusion is enlightenment, within suffering release. Nature based religions include all elements of living and dying, the living and the dead are equally real, therefore the domain of experiencing awakening is offered at all times, in all places and people.

"
.........

Why don't you just shut up?
"
.........

Yes.
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Reply from zen-zen
Oct.23.2008
02:25PM EDT 
vertical line Please calm down. This is a local place for local people, we want no trouble here.

Rustic sees zen and meditation as something that you "don't do" in it's suchness, yet he is able to write and think as we speak. Clearly he knows a bit about this topic but still something writes and acts. Does Rustic want to say that there is no qualitative difference between a life with meditation to a life that's not ifluenced by meditative practices? I think Rustic knows there is a difference but perhaps the case is that he doesn't care about it. That's just as fine as well.

Shayne, practically this separation is something we see too often in ourselves and in the lives of others. My intention is to shed light on this issue since I see beneficial results rising from this discussion.

Still - the original inquiry stands:
What is your approach to meditation and how do you practice it?
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Reply from zen-zen
Oct.23.2008
02:29PM EDT 
vertical line Woodsy, I appreciate your effort to write truthfully. Please don't shut up. :)
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Reply from ______
Oct.23.2008
02:43PM EDT 
vertical line Meditation is good for nothing.
I act as if I have free will and yet I do nothing at all.
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Reply from -----0
Oct.23.2008
02:49PM EDT 
vertical line Sitting helps, in a way a fitness center does. But the best practice for life - is life.
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Reply from zen-zen
Oct.23.2008
02:51PM EDT 
vertical line Attention is a paralysing thing.
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Reply from -----0
Oct.23.2008
03:07PM EDT 
vertical line Thinking of technicalities is paralyzing.
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Reply from 9999999
Oct.23.2008
03:13PM EDT 
Email 9999999
vertical line after hearing about 'meditation' and how 'you do it' 'i did it for a long time' thinking that it was something that must be done for me to get what i want


then 'i took an honest look at everything i was doing' and 'saw that absolutely nothing was happening' and that i had been 'taken for a clucking ride'


i have never meditated since
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Reply from 9999999
Oct.23.2008
03:15PM EDT 
Email 9999999
vertical line 'i have never meditated since'


what was it that 'i thought i was getting' ?
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Reply from -----0
Oct.23.2008
03:34PM EDT 
vertical line when nothing is happening, that is what is supposed to happen
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Reply from Woodsman
Oct.23.2008
03:51PM EDT 
vertical line If I'm quiet, that's meditation. 
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Reply from zen-zen
Oct.23.2008
04:26PM EDT 
vertical line Woodsy,
Did I get you right - all that's required is to be quiet? This sounds good to me. One can be 'quiet' while doing all the things in life which makes a big difference to the persone who's not 'quiet'.

Let us talk more about that quietness, shall we?
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Reply from ______
Oct.23.2008
04:32PM EDT 
vertical line Did I get me right? - Silence isn't an absence of sound. Silence is an absence of self.
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Reply from Woodsman
Oct.23.2008
05:29PM EDT 
vertical line Well, I don't believe it is a separate silence, the kind that would seclude you from taking part in the "mess" of noise, delusion, ego. But the silence has a kind of shock value to begin with, in that we may be silenced by the sound of sadness, fear, or grief... not at all my own doing, not a direct choice. So there is a universe connection thing happening as a plan, but I don't want to lead in that direction, it's tough to know what to say, and that could be another form of silence, words just clutter that space.

Silence is also being able to look inside of the noise around you, and still be quiet, just observing, and when the move to speak comes up, you just take it, and it feels like gold, it feels like the first words ever spoken. Ok, I'm rambling, ego,  back to silence.
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Reply from ______
Oct.23.2008
06:22PM EDT 
vertical line Silence is liberating, alive, dynamic. In silence, fear is still frightening, yet I am not afraid of fear; pain still hurts, yet I am not hurt by pain.
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Reply from Woodsman
Oct.23.2008
07:32PM EDT 
vertical line In Silence every sound has equal value, because equality if what it's all about. We are here to equalize the noise, to listen and hear though the suffering, until even time dissolves, past and future all relate to what is present of equal value, every experience becomes qualified. Ok. Read Robert Sardello's book Silence.
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Reply from Snibbler
Oct.23.2008
09:31PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Silence is liberating, alive, dynamic. In silence, fear is still frightening, yet I am not afraid of fear; pain still hurts, yet I am not hurt by pain."
.........
Hmmm...
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Reply from immortal 1
Oct.24.2008
03:53AM EDT 
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At first we meditate to separate from everything. 

Then as we meditate we see that there is no separation. 

So the more we meditate the more our whole life becomes a meditation.

And that does make driving a car more interesting sometimes. 

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Reply from IZIZIZ
Oct.24.2008
06:48AM EDT 
vertical line What is meditation?
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Reply from raeej91
Oct.24.2008
07:00AM EDT 
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Even though I heard that there should be no distinction between practice and everyday life, at first I couldn't really understand how the two were one and the same.  Here was practice; rigid and full of concetrated effort.  Here was everday life; relaxed and laid back.

But the more I practiced the more I brought my practice into everyday life.  Actually zazen is just one practice of many practices that make up our everyday lives.  It was the attitude that I developed in zazen that was being transfered to the other practices of my everyday life.  I began to make a stronger effort in doing things.  In zazen I tried very hard to practice and apply myself fully to keeping the posture straight and counting the breath.  I noticed that I started to make the same conscientious effort when I was jogging, washing the dishes, or studying.  I started to do things the best that I could.

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Reply from zen-zen
Oct.25.2008
02:29AM EDT 
vertical line I find this discussion very fruitful. Thank you all for sharing.

It seems to me that all of us have felt the same and gone through a similar path to get to this understanding of "meditation". Or whatever we like to call it, perhaps silence is as good. We've taken different approaches but ended to the same.

It is possible to speak of this way that leads to quietness but once the quietness begins speaking ceases. Thus, no information escapes the abyss and none can be shared between us about it.

Yet, I feel that I'd like to discuss with you about what comes after the silence although I know that the attempts are futile and worthless. Yet, there is vague hope that it would be somehow fruitful.

Allow me to explain - My latest advances have led me to a situation where I have encountered something completely new. This is difficult for me to explain and understand. It is as if the quality of the practice had escalated to a completely different level. The quietness has always been there, but whereas the world still existed before, now it completely disappears as if it never existed.

Can you share about this?
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Reply from immortal 1
Oct.25.2008
04:34AM EDT 
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Quote: "Meditation is good for nothing.
I act as if I have free will and yet I do nothing at all.
"
.........

In a rubber room in a straight jacket could be the perfect setting for meditation. 

Unless of course your nose itches.

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