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→→→→ vertical line TOPIC: BRAHMAN
vertical line Posted on Aug.27.2012 @ 05:26AM EDT by starduster

In Hinduism, Brahman (???????? brahman) is the one supreme, universal Spirit that is the origin and support of the phenomenal universe.[1] Brahman is sometimes referred to as the Absolute or Godhead[2] which is the Divine Ground[3] of all matter, energy, time, space, being, and everything in and beyond this universe. Brahman is conceived as personal ("with qualities"), impersonal ("without qualities") and/or supreme depending on the philosophical school.

The sages of the Upanishads teach that Brahman is the ultimate essence of material phenomena (including the original identity of the human self) that cannot be seen or heard but whose nature can be known through the development of self-knowledge (atma jnana).[4] According to Advaita, a liberated human being (jivanmukta) has realised Brahman as his or her own true self (see atman).

The Isha Upanishad says:

Au? – That supreme Brahman is infinite, and this conditioned Brahman is infinite. The infinite proceeds from infinite. If you subtract the infinite from the infinite, the infinite remains alone.


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Reply from starduster
Aug.27.2012
05:40AM EDT 
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Einstein said that nothing truly exists except the energy that everything is made of, and I agree with that except that I would say that the Spirit, as I know It, is the conscious awareness that has that energy as Its essential body.  And since it can take any form It wishes in that energy, thus the paradigm *Things as It is*.

Panentheism (from Greek p?? (pân) "all"; ?? (en) "in"; and ?e?? (theós) "God"; "all-in-God") is a belief system which posits that the divine exists (be it a monotheistic God, polytheistic gods, or an eternal cosmic animating force), interpenetrates every part of nature and timelessly extends beyond it. Panentheism differentiates itself from pantheism, which holds that the divine is synonymous with the universe.[1]

In panentheism, the universe in the first formulation is practically the whole itself. In the second formulation, the universe and the divine are not ontologically equivalent. In panentheism, God is viewed as the eternal animating force behind the universe. Some versions suggest that the universe is nothing more than the manifest part of God. In some forms of panentheism, the cosmos exists within God, who in turn "pervades" or is "in" the cosmos. While pantheism asserts that 'All is God', panentheism goes further to claim that God is greater than the universe. In addition, some forms indicate that the universe is contained within God.[1] Much Hindu thought is highly characterized by panentheism and pantheism.

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141689
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Reply from shayne
Aug.27.2012
10:00AM EDT 
Email shayne
vertical line huh....im god and so are you. we are each a reality speaking out.


vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141691
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Reply from starduster
Aug.27.2012
10:55AM EDT 
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Quote: "huh....im god and so are you. we are each a reality speaking out.


"
.........

You are God being you.  I am God being me.  The computer Im using is God being a computer..., etc etc. 

That goes for anything and everything, singularly or in groups, or altogether as One.

Characters, props, the stage itself, and the audience, all One.

And each of us is our own reality too, as you say.

We are all, each of us, God from a different perspective.

We are all, each of us, equally important, and unimportant.

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141706
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Reply from nibble
Aug.27.2012
02:13PM EDT 
vertical line http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_eGwX72zgUYg/SeLTcoiFrJI/AAAAAAAAADc/bGERvAuaRDE/s1600/bill4.gif
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141707
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Reply from so_teh
Aug.27.2012
07:56PM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line Broheim
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
01:19AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Einstein said that nothing truly exists except the energy that everything is made of, and I agree with that except that I would say that the Spirit, as I know It, is the conscious awareness that has that energy as Its essential body.  And since it can take any form It wishes in that energy, thus the paradigm *Things as It is*.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141717
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
01:40AM EDT 
vertical line Of course, even the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else can in itself be an everyday thing. So, you know...appreciate that too. Unless you'd rather not. In which case...don't.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141720
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Reply from Dalai Lama
Aug.28.2012
04:21AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "

Einstein said that nothing truly exists except the energy that everything is made of, and I agree with that except that I would say that the Spirit, as I know It, is the conscious awareness that has that energy as Its essential body.  And since it can take any form It wishes in that energy, thus the paradigm *Things as It is*.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

Thats okay.

Abstract thought is not for everyone. 

And indeed, more often than not I just turn off the internal dialogue and relax for the sake of relaxation.  Nothing wrong with that.   

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

Thats okay.

Abstract thought is not for everyone. 

And indeed, more often than not I just turn off the internal dialogue and relax for the sake of relaxation.  Nothing wrong with that.   

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141721
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Reply from starduster
Aug.28.2012
07:54AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "

Einstein said that nothing truly exists except the energy that everything is made of, and I agree with that except that I would say that the Spirit, as I know It, is the conscious awareness that has that energy as Its essential body.  And since it can take any form It wishes in that energy, thus the paradigm *Things as It is*.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

I say *Things as It is*, while you say *things as they are*.

That is the difference in our states of being.  Non-dual *as It is*, and dualistic *as they are*.

It is good that you have learned to *shut off* thinking, establishing a *calm emptiness*.  Yes, that is good zazen and I also do that everyday, many times a day.  It is only a moment away.  But it is not an end result in itself, it is not the point of Zen, or Buddhism, or any other religious doctrine other than your own just for you.

I have also heard it said that the point of Zen, or Buddhism, is to understand the concept of *Dependent Arising*, which might be equally well put as interdependent arising.  Shutting off thinking could be just a means of stimuli avoidance, to stop the demons, or it could be a means to clear the mind to make way for understanding to emerge. 

Depends on the individual.  In chess it is said, *Threats must be parried before advances can be made*.  You have to get past the gargoyles to enter the cathedral.  So it is good that you have left behind a mind of turmoil and found *calm emptiness*. 

Thats a start, a step toward understanding, so you have evidently progressed from beginner to novice.  Bravo !!  Congratulations !!

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

I say *Things as It is*, while you say *things as they are*.

That is the difference in our states of being.  Non-dual *as It is*, and dualistic *as they are*.

It is good that you have learned to *shut off* thinking, establishing a *calm emptiness*.  Yes, that is good zazen and I also do that everyday, many times a day.  It is only a moment away.  But it is not an end result in itself, it is not the point of Zen, or Buddhism, or any other religious doctrine other than your own just for you.

I have also heard it said that the point of Zen, or Buddhism, is to understand the concept of *Dependent Arising*, which might be equally well put as interdependent arising.  Shutting off thinking could be just a means of stimuli avoidance, to stop the demons, or it could be a means to clear the mind to make way for understanding to emerge. 

Depends on the individual.  In chess it is said, *Threats must be parried before advances can be made*.  You have to get past the gargoyles to enter the cathedral.  So it is good that you have left behind a mind of turmoil and found *calm emptiness*. 

Thats a start, a step toward understanding, so you have evidently progressed from beginner to novice.  Bravo !!  Congratulations !!

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141723
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
10:34AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Abstract thought is not for everyone.
"
.........

Yes, it is for everyone. Abstract thought is what allows you identify what things are, as compared to and contrasted with others. Their qualities. Look at coffee, then look at your shirt, and say "Oh! They're both the same!" Same what? Same color. Black. Black is an abstraction of the similarity you see. The idea of color is an abstraction of the quality that is similar. This is correct abstraction. We can do that so that you don't try to drink a glass of pee and think it's a cup coffee. That wouldn't be too good.

But, the only way you know what I'm talking about when I say "color" and "black" is that you have seen the same thing and made these same abstractions yourself. So, when we talk about coffee having color, and that color being black, we are in agreement and everything is fine. Problems arise when there is disagreement as to what we're talking about. Disagreement arises because of how and why we talk about it.

So, someone asks for a cup of coffee, just give them a cup of coffee and don't try to convince them that the coffee is really something else, like "Spirit with an essential body made of energy." Unless you just want a problem. In which case, go right ahead.

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141726
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
10:35AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

"
.........

Some people need to be corrected a lot.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141727
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
10:38AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "
I say *Things as It is*, while you say *things as they are*. That is the difference in our states of being.  Non-dual *as It is*, and dualistic *as they are*."

You made "difference in our states of being" yourself, in your own mind. You made the duality. My words had nothing to do with the duality of duality/non-duality.

Anyone can experience the oneness of all things. Anyone can also experience the multiplicity of all things. Anyone can experience the emptiness of all things. Whether you call it one, or many, or emptiness...it's the same. Problems arise when you attach to any of these views in particular and make it special.

Just sitting without thinking can make you appreciate the emptiness of being. Just drinking coffee can make you appreciate the oneness of being. Just watching the world can make you appreciate the variety of being. But, if oneness invades your thoughts all the time, how can you appreciate the variety? If variety invades your thoughts all the time, then how can you appreciate emptiness?

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141728
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
10:44AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "It is good that you have learned to *shut off* thinking, establishing a *calm emptiness*.  Yes, that is good zazen and I also do that everyday, many times a day.  It is only a moment away.  But it is not an end result in itself, it is not the point of Zen, or Buddhism, or any other religious doctrine other than your own just for you.

I have also heard it said that the point of Zen, or Buddhism, is to understand the concept of *Dependent Arising*, which might be equally well put as interdependent arising.  Shutting off thinking could be just a means of stimuli avoidance, to stop the demons, or it could be a means to clear the mind to make way for understanding to emerge.

Depends on the individual.  In chess it is said, *Threats must be parried before advances can be made*.  You have to get past the gargoyles to enter the cathedral.  So it is good that you have left behind a mind of turmoil and found *calm emptiness*.

Thats a start, a step toward understanding, so you have evidently progressed from beginner to novice.  Bravo !!  Congratulations !!


"
.........

Some of that stuff you wrote is okay, and some of it causes you problems. Everything will be okay, though. Have a cup of coffee!
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141729
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Reply from floating_a
Aug.28.2012
03:07PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "

Einstein said that nothing truly exists except the energy that everything is made of, and I agree with that except that I would say that the Spirit, as I know It, is the conscious awareness that has that energy as Its essential body.  And since it can take any form It wishes in that energy, thus the paradigm *Things as It is*.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

Thats okay.

Abstract thought is not for everyone. 

And indeed, more often than not I just turn off the internal dialogue and relax for the sake of relaxation.  Nothing wrong with that.   

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

Thats okay.

Abstract thought is not for everyone. 

And indeed, more often than not I just turn off the internal dialogue and relax for the sake of relaxation.  Nothing wrong with that.   

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

"
.........

Wow starduster is Dalai Lama

Weird!
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141733
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
03:08PM EDT 
vertical line LOL

Yeah. :-)

(You didn't know that?! O.O )
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141734
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Reply from starduster
Aug.28.2012
04:04PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "

Einstein said that nothing truly exists except the energy that everything is made of, and I agree with that except that I would say that the Spirit, as I know It, is the conscious awareness that has that energy as Its essential body.  And since it can take any form It wishes in that energy, thus the paradigm *Things as It is*.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

Thats okay.

Abstract thought is not for everyone. 

And indeed, more often than not I just turn off the internal dialogue and relax for the sake of relaxation.  Nothing wrong with that.   

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

Thats okay.

Abstract thought is not for everyone. 

And indeed, more often than not I just turn off the internal dialogue and relax for the sake of relaxation.  Nothing wrong with that.   

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

"
.........

Energy...Spirit..."essential body"...paradigm....

What do any of these have to do with what is?

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, there it is. When you drink coffee, there it is. When you put on your shirt, there it is. When you pee, there it is.

None of this has anything to do with paradigms of Spirit with energy as its essential body. It's just waking up, putting your feet on the floor, drinking coffee, putting on your shirt, and peeing. All those other things you guys are talking about, and all this trying to explain "Things as it Is", keeps you from being able to just appreciate things as they are.

That's why Zen Buddhism is rooted in the practice of just sitting. When you find the calm emptiness of just sitting, then you just appreciate everyday things as everyday things, without the constant fuss of trying to explain it all away as something else.
"
.........

Thats okay.

Abstract thought is not for everyone. 

And indeed, more often than not I just turn off the internal dialogue and relax for the sake of relaxation.  Nothing wrong with that.   

Its not a question of right or wrong, correct or incorrect, just be what makes you happy.

"
.........

"
.........

I must bow deeply and aplogize to the Dalai Lama.

I subscribe to the Lamas Facebook Page, and sometimes transfer things that he has said to this site to share with others.  I use his moniker to do that, to give credit where it is due, and take none for myself.

But in this case, I forgot to log out Dalai Lama and log back in as myself before doing another posting.  So for that I deeply apologize. 

Thank you.  I will try to be more careful.  I just wasnt paying attention.

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Reply from starduster
Aug.28.2012
04:20PM EDT 
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Problems arise when there is disagreement as to what we're talking about. Disagreement arises because of how and why we talk about it. (esoteric)

---------------------------------------------

You think you have the answer, and want to *correct* people to your way of thinking.

I must confess, I find that to be very presumptuous and rude, here or anywhere.  On another scale, Hitler did that to most of Europe and millions of people died because of it. 

It is not a redeeming factor that *Mein Kompf* was a bestseller before he came to power, meaning that most people agreed with him, or were desperate enough to listen.

I dont believe there is a patent answer.  I believe each person must find their own answer for themselves, and that zazen, meditation, prayer, self-hypnosis, therapy, and whatever else you can find to use will only help you to find your answer within yourself.

I think it is great that you have found your answer within yourself.  I have also found my answer for me.  But I dont think these answers are for everyone.

if I can help someone else to find their own answer, cool.  If not they can just ignore me and keep looking on their own, and thats cool too. And of course there are many others here too who have already found their own answers.

Live and let be.


vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141740
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Reply from simple
Aug.28.2012
04:27PM EDT 
Email simple
vertical line Quote: "

And of course there are many others here too who have already found their own answers.

.........

.........

Cool.

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 141741
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
05:24PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Problems arise when there is disagreement as to what we're talking about. Disagreement arises because of how and why we talk about it. (esoteric)

---------------------------------------------

You think you have the answer, and want to *correct* people to your way of thinking.

I must confess, I find that to be very presumptuous and rude, here or anywhere.  On another scale, Hitler did that to most of Europe and millions of people died because of it. 

It is not a redeeming factor that *Mein Kompf* was a bestseller before he came to power, meaning that most people agreed with him, or were desperate enough to listen.

I dont believe there is a patent answer.  I believe each person must find their own answer for themselves, and that zazen, meditation, prayer, self-hypnosis, therapy, and whatever else you can find to use will only help you to find your answer within yourself.

I think it is great that you have found your answer within yourself.  I have also found my answer for me.  But I dont think these answers are for everyone.

if I can help someone else to find their own answer, cool.  If not they can just ignore me and keep looking on their own, and thats cool too. And of course there are many others here too who have already found their own answers.

Live and let be.


"
.........

The answer is always in front of you, Don. And it has nothing to do with thinking. When you drink some coffee, the answer is just drinking coffee. When you honk your horn, the answer is just honking your horn. When you post on Zen Guide, the answer is just posting on Zen Guide.

You keep having problems because you want to take drinking coffee, honking your horn, and posting on Zen Guide, and make them fit your thinking, as if there were a different answer than what they already are. As if there was a different answer for everyone, when just being and doing IS the same answer for everyone.

In other words, when someone disagrees with you or corrects you, you think they're not living and letting you be. But really, that's only because YOU are not living and letting you be, and has nothing to do with that other person.

The funny thing is, we're talking about the same thing, and saying the same thing. Only, that same thing makes me happy, and it makes you upset and mad. Why is that?

Some people need a lot of correcting.
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Reply from simple
Aug.28.2012
05:36PM EDT 
Email simple
vertical line This is what I would call a "contradiction"
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
05:45PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "This is what I would call a "contradiction""
.........

You'll get that when people start using words. :-P
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Reply from simple
Aug.28.2012
05:58PM EDT 
Email simple
vertical line yes sir.
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
06:07PM EDT 
vertical line Zen Guide is like the Republican National Convention. If you walk in looking for a disagreement to your thinking, you'll find it. If you walk in looking for agreement to your thinking, you might find that too, but you'll most certainly find disagreement as well. This only becomes a problem when disagreement is a problem to you. Problems can be desire, longing, anxiety, sorrow, pain, fear, anger, and resentment.

But if you walk in not looking for anything other than what is....people being people together....then there will be no problem for you. Maybe some other people will have a problem, and that's okay. Just do what you need to do, with perfect composure.
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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
06:08PM EDT 
vertical line Um. Log in, not walk in. No one walks into the Zen Guide. If they do, they have a much bigger problem than mere disagreement. :-P

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Reply from esoteric
Aug.28.2012
06:11PM EDT 
vertical line One does not simply walk into Zen Guide.

(YES!!! I have been waiting to use that line here for YEARS!)
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Reply from Joe Chip
Aug.29.2012
05:19AM EDT 
vertical line You were caught with an unseen hook on an invisible line, long enough to allow you to wander to the ends of the earth, and be brought back with a twitch upon the thread.
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Reply from starduster
Aug.29.2012
05:39AM EDT 
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As if there was a different answer for everyone, when just being and doing IS the same answer for everyone.  (esoteric)

-----------------------------------------------------

I rest my case.

I do sometimes say, *Just be who you are, where you are, doing what you are doing*, but the *who you are* part of that is just as important as the rest of it.

We are all different for a reason, aka *dependent arising*, aka interdependent arising. 

Your approach wouldnt hurt anyone, but then again I dont think it would help anyone either.

To wit, I think your approach is more of a shutting down in the universe than a turning on of the universe.  Wheres the love, Gov ??

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Reply from Chryseis
Aug.29.2012
05:49AM EDT 
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Funnily enough, I read the following from a book this afternoon and it reminded me of the flow of the topics on zenguide, and of koans:

From 'The Great Transformation:  the world in the time of buddha, socrates, confucious and jeremiah', by Karen Armstrong,

'[Brahman could be experienced in silence] A ritual often ended with the brahmodya competition to find a verbal formula that expressed the mystery of the brahman.  The challenger asked a difficult and enigmatic question, and his opponenet answered in an equally elusive manner.  The match continued until one of the contestants was unable to repond:  reduced to silence, he was forced to withdraw.  The transcendence of the brahman was sensed in the mysterious clash of unanswerable questions that led to a stunning realization of the impotence of speech.  For a few sacred moments, the competitiors felt one with the mysterious force that held the whole of life together, and the winner could say that he was the brahman.'

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Reply from Joe Chip
Aug.29.2012
06:18AM EDT 
vertical line Living Water.
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Reply from simple
Aug.29.2012
06:36AM EDT 
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Unwilling Wilderness

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Reply from starduster
Aug.29.2012
11:02AM EDT 
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A silent mind, since no ill thought can dwell there.

A gentle and sweet smile, since no ill feeling can dwell there.

This is why the Buddha is always depicted sitting still and smiling.

It may not be the actual reason, but it is reason enough.

Mom used to say, *Smile, or I will give you a reason not to.*

I usually found that after several minutes of smiling I felt like smiling.  So when I kick back and relax in silence, I generally plant a smile on my face while I am at it.

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Reply from esoteric
Aug.29.2012
11:16AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

A silent mind, since no ill thought can dwell there.

A gentle and sweet smile, since no ill feeling can dwell there.

This is why the Buddha is always depicted sitting still and smiling.

It may not be the actual reason, but it is reason enough.

Mom used to say, *Smile, or I will give you a reason not to.*

I usually found that after several minutes of smiling I felt like smiling.  So when I kick back and relax in silence, I generally plant a smile on my face while I am at it.

"
.........

Good reason.
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