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→→→→ vertical line TOPIC: WHAT TO DO WITH A ZEN FORUM.?
vertical line Posted on May.01.2013 @ 03:11PM EDT by clangor
.
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Reply from clangor
May.01.2013
03:13PM EDT 
vertical line I mean, "but-what"
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 151491
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Reply from esoteric
May.01.2013
06:55PM EDT 
vertical line Right now, I'm working on the realization that Zen is a wisdom tradition that teaches practices for living wisely. Having been away from practice for some time (including this forum), I'm looking at it now from a perspective where I can see what is necessary for my growth in wisdom and peace, and what is not.

One thing I see clearly is the wisdom of discipline. It's one of the most common things that people rebel against when they learn about Zen, saying "Oh, this belief that one must practice these things with discipline and repetition is just delusional thinking." Well, not really. We just say that because we don't like it, because it's not easy.

But the benefits of each aspect of practice, including discipline, become clearer over time. It's like not liking vegetables, but liking bread. Eventually, over time, if you are paying attention, you will realize that your body needs vegetables, and that you feel and function better when you eat them every day along with your bread.

Another insight I have is how simple things really are. But the simplicity is only there when all the other stuff gets cleared away. We are very complex, because we have capacity for such variety, but that variety also confuses us and makes our thinking complex. It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds. This is what we mean by practice. We keep practicing until finally we can see a little clearer. Or a lot clearer, as the case may be.
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Reply from esoteric
May.01.2013
07:03PM EDT 
vertical line More clearly, not clearer. Adverb, -ly. :P
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Reply from leoj99
May.02.2013
02:27AM EDT 
vertical line Zen Forums?....lol
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Reply from leoj99
May.02.2013
02:28AM EDT 
vertical line It is the venue for Mental Gymnastics...lol
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Reply from leoj99
May.02.2013
02:29AM EDT 
vertical line Why are you tired doing mental gymnastics now...?
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 151540
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
03:36AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line why do you taint people and never offer anything positive ?




vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 151543
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
03:36AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line taunt
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
03:39AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line talking alot about empty mind,  and then filling it with thoughts about members posts
or utube sermons ?

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 151545
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
03:42AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line i guess in all fairness you are just doing what we all do, that being showing your mind 
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 151546
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Reply from Avisitor
May.02.2013
04:46AM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
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Reply from cinchona
May.02.2013
04:54AM EDT 
vertical line To obtain complete enlightenment one must want it like a drowning man wants a breath.

Tibetin book of living and dying ( i think:)
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 151549
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Reply from Avisitor
May.02.2013
05:07AM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line What is complete enlightenment??

Kensho has happened to many who don't even want it or understand it.
It can destroy your life or make it better.
So what is this complete enlightenment that you talk about???
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Reply from football
May.02.2013
05:49AM EDT 
Email football
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"What to do with a Zen Forum?"

If my computer is not dirty I see you have put a point mark to the subject.

Zen is being pointlessness.

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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
05:53AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
"
.........
an instant promted at the precise time the mind is ready after much practice,
and practice can be a lifetime of planting rice,
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Reply from football
May.02.2013
05:56AM EDT 
Email football
vertical line Quote: "

"What to do with a Zen Forum?"

If my computer is not dirty I see you have put a point mark to the subject.

Zen is being pointlessness.

"
.........

"
.........

btw, I said to clangor.

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Reply from esoteric
May.02.2013
06:26AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
"
.........

If you had had instant Dharma transmission, then you would know exactly who was saying these things.
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Reply from esoteric
May.02.2013
06:43AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "why do you taint people and never offer anything positive ?

"
.........

He's busy whipping the cartwheel while his horse is stuck in the mud.

Get it? Cartwheel? Gymnastics? :-P
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
07:10AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line sadly i do get it ;)

i like the cartwheel analogy though.
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
07:19AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line i read once that understanding does not mean you are completely removed from all ideas, it means you can understand the futility. So when the ignorance raises its head you are able to notice it smile and at that point correct it. this is practice.

i also remember beginning to practice and thinking about statements on how meditation becomes the predominant state of mind after practice (i did not like this idea considering how difficult it was just to sit at the begining) but strangely as esoteric just said it is the most natural thing. and the ignorance seems like a effort.
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
08:00AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line but is that my ignorance talking ?

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Reply from Avisitor
May.02.2013
09:59AM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
"
.........
an instant promted at the precise time the mind is ready after much practice,
and practice can be a lifetime of planting rice,
"
.........

Yes, or practice can be a day. Time is not relevant. Quality is ...
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
10:37AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line for sure, 
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Reply from justin
May.02.2013
10:40AM EDT 
Email justin
vertical line what i meant in a criptic kinda way is that practice isnt always specific to what we might consider practice, (meditation etc) but anything may prepare one for the instant transmission. that is not exactly instant i imagine 
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Reply from Avisitor
May.02.2013
12:53PM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line Quote: "what i meant in a criptic kinda way is that practice isnt always specific to what we might consider practice, (meditation etc) but anything may prepare one for the instant transmission. that is not exactly instant i imagine  "
.........

Yes, I know what you mean. Thanks.
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Reply from football
May.02.2013
06:34PM EDT 
Email football
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"What to do with a Zen Forum?"

What not to do with a Zen Forum?

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Reply from leoj99
May.03.2013
01:48AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
"
.........

If you had had instant Dharma transmission, then you would know exactly who was saying these things.
"
.........

Yeah  he is just passing the ball..lol
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Reply from esoteric
May.03.2013
05:28AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
"
.........

If you had had instant Dharma transmission, then you would know exactly who was saying these things.
"
.........

Yeah  he is just passing the ball..lol
"
.........

No, he dropped the ball. And so did you.
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Reply from cinchona
May.03.2013
06:43AM EDT 
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Reply from Avisitor
May.03.2013
09:08AM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
"
.........

If you had had instant Dharma transmission, then you would know exactly who was saying these things.
"
.........

The question was rhetorical.
But, believe whatever you wish.
It doesn't change a thing ... hahaha
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Reply from Avisitor
May.03.2013
10:40AM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line When one looks at things, it can be light or dark, heavy or light, big or small
Seeing this and thinking that, one knows that objects sometimes comes with duality.
Duality is a part of objects. It is not part of the mind.
To describe something is to put filters on and say this about it and that about it.
Mind experiences and yet there is no experience apart from the mind.
No object, no thing, empty, emptiness ... duality doesn't exist.

Realize that space ... one is pure awareness.
Not mind, not body ... awareness
Awareness reflects whatever is in front of it.
No frame of reference for "I" or "self" or "ego"
When ready one sees oneself ... without the filters or fog .... hahahaha

I'm sorry for the ranting.
My mind has been that way for a while


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Reply from esoteric
May.03.2013
10:48AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "Quote: "It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds."
.........

Who is saying all these things???

In Zen, the transmission of the Dharma can be in an instant.
"
.........

If you had had instant Dharma transmission, then you would know exactly who was saying these things.
"
.........

The question was rhetorical.
But, believe whatever you wish.
It doesn't change a thing ... hahaha
"
.........

Your words are your words. No belief necessary.
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Reply from Avisitor
May.03.2013
11:07AM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line Quote: "Your words are your words. No belief necessary.
"
.........


You do hold beliefs. You just ain't telling what cards you have .... hahahaha
Roll your dice and hang your hat .... hahahaha
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Reply from nibble
May.03.2013
11:40AM EDT 
vertical line www.zen-forum.com
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Reply from clangor
May.04.2013
12:28AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

"What to do with a Zen Forum?"

What not to do with a Zen Forum?

"
.........

You are the ONE, baby-baby.
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Reply from clangor
May.04.2013
12:29AM EDT 
vertical line But JA DON'T KNOW IT. !!

;-).
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Reply from clangor
May.04.2013
12:51AM EDT 
vertical line As for the rest: "Nihilists!": Zen-is-not-nihilism. No-Karma:Karma (i.e. Non-Embrace:Embrace - as "bound-up-n-going").

Avisitor>
--------
No frame of reference for "I" or "self" or "ego"

My mind has been that way for a while
--------

You said there was one. Embrace none embracing nothingness - 'or-so', 'as-in'.

esoteric> No belief necessary.

Statement not necessary. Shouldzy-none. Be.

Before you are; I am; [and] before mind:I am.

quote: "complete enlightenment"

remove "complete".
remove "enlightenment".
-=bing=-!

football: Zen is being pointlessness.

Unless you mean: "Zen is without pointlessness with none(of-anything-at-all-whatsoever-but-completely-is-such-that...)".

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Reply from clangor
May.04.2013
12:55AM EDT 
vertical line ... way (it is not the affirming thing-any - "pointless" is claim is delusion).
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Reply from clangor
May.04.2013
12:56AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "WHAT TO DO WITH A ZEN FORUM.? "

FART!

 - - - Now, you're getting it! . .
.

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Reply from clangor
May.04.2013
12:58AM EDT 
vertical line Live point.-=is=-less (living zen).
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Reply from esoteric
May.04.2013
03:49AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Avisitor> The question was rhetorical.
But, believe whatever you wish.
It doesn't change a thing ... hahaha

esoteric> Your words are your words. No belief necessary.

clangor> Statement not necessary. Shouldzy-none. Be.

Before you are; I am; [and] before mind:I am.

Zen is being pointlessness.

"

.........

Read again, clangor. When someone raises it, there is a reply. What sort of reply? Just look and see.

There is no before, and there is a point. You miss the point, throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

You are the point. The point is now. Denial will not make it go away.
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Reply from cinchona
May.04.2013
05:51AM EDT 
vertical line your actions are your only true identity,
your actions are the ground on which you stand.
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Reply from Joe Chip
Jul.28.2013
09:34AM EDT 
vertical line I'm trying to keep Snowden out of gaol.
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Reply from Joe Chip
Jul.31.2013
09:13AM EDT 
vertical line King of the Buskers


Blue Eyes
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Reply from *CSEe*
Jul.31.2013
09:38AM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
vertical line Debate , discuss , exchance views / experiences ............
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Reply from Joe Chip
Jul.31.2013
09:56AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Inter Galactic Overlord of the Wide Open Spaces


Blue Eyes


"
.........
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Reply from football
Jul.31.2013
10:44AM EDT 
Email football
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BreakfastOnPluto

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Reply from Joe Chip
Jul.31.2013
01:12PM EDT 
vertical line Panic In Detroit
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Reply from cosmicomic
Aug.19.2013
06:47AM EDT 
Email cosmicomic
vertical line Do the Big Two-Do.
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Reply from Phil Space
Apr.18.2014
08:20AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line God, for this I was spared?
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Reply from Phil Space
Apr.18.2014
09:05AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line God, for this I was a banned & doned?
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Reply from so_teh
Apr.18.2014
11:23AM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line Is that you Joe Chip?
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Reply from Phil Space
Apr.18.2014
02:46PM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line Brown Moses [wisdom reekin' outa me]

I'll gives ya him
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Reply from so_teh
Apr.19.2014
12:44AM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line I have no way of knowing or caring unless you're listening.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 156210
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Reply from Phil Space
Apr.19.2014
06:45AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line True
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Reply from Phil Space
May.06.2014
07:40AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line The website you seek
Cannot be located, but
Countless more exist
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Reply from Phil Space
May.13.2014
07:55PM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line Dear reader, you are now the reader of yourself. The words acting as a lens, are like an optical instrument through which you see into yourself - you see.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 156458
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Reply from leoj99
May.13.2014
11:17PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Right now, I'm working on the realization that Zen is a wisdom tradition that teaches practices for living wisely. Having been away from practice for some time (including this forum), I'm looking at it now from a perspective where I can see what is necessary for my growth in wisdom and peace, and what is not.

One thing I see clearly is the wisdom of discipline. It's one of the most common things that people rebel against when they learn about Zen, saying "Oh, this belief that one must practice these things with discipline and repetition is just delusional thinking." Well, not really. We just say that because we don't like it, because it's not easy.

But the benefits of each aspect of practice, including discipline, become clearer over time. It's like not liking vegetables, but liking bread. Eventually, over time, if you are paying attention, you will realize that your body needs vegetables, and that you feel and function better when you eat them every day along with your bread.

Another insight I have is how simple things really are. But the simplicity is only there when all the other stuff gets cleared away. We are very complex, because we have capacity for such variety, but that variety also confuses us and makes our thinking complex. It takes time, effort, discipline, and long-suffering to clear out those weeds. This is what we mean by practice. We keep practicing until finally we can see a little clearer. Or a lot clearer, as the case may be.
"
.........

At least you realize that thoughts are all delusions...LOL
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Reply from Phil Space
May.14.2014
04:23AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line A crash reduces
Your expensive computer
To a simple stone
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 156464
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Reply from Phil Space
May.14.2014
05:16PM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line You step in the stream,
But the water has moved on.
This page is not here.
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Reply from Phil Space
May.15.2014
06:12AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line What to do with a zen forum?

Reign within.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 156478
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Reply from Phil Space
May.27.2014
07:06AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line What to do with this forum?
Forget about it.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 156660
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Reply from ---T e
May.27.2014
04:59PM EDT 
Email ---T e
vertical line c'mon Phil Space there should be still something to think.
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Reply from Phil Space
May.28.2014
08:01AM EDT 
Email Phil Space
vertical line You'll have to obtain your sustenance of delusion elsewhere.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 156664
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