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  One day, when the brilliant Chinese Cha'n master Chao-chou was sweeping
the court of the monastery, a man asked him:
-Ch'an monastery supposed to be clean and pure. Why is there dust to sweep?
Chao-chou replied:
-It came... continue...

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→→→→ vertical line TOPIC: BUDDHA TEACHING
vertical line Posted on May.28.2013 @ 02:37AM EDT by leoj99
Buddha Teaching..

1. The Buddha himself stated that he was teaching a method to train oneself to directly see knowledge/wisdom,not teaching the actual knowledge itself (hence the emphasis in Zen especially that conceptual understanding is dead understanding and that experience is the important thing. He was being a finger rather than describing the moon), and that the training method was useful only in as far as it led to this result (forget the finger and look at the moon, metaphor of the raft crossing the stream and then being abandoned etc).

2. He therefore had no need to disabuse people of their mistaken beliefs unless they directly prevented the attainment of realisation - he was teaching them a way that lead them to see which of their beliefs were mistaken, so no need to tell them first unless it helped them get there. Hence his noble silence on metaphysical questions.

3. His actual teachings were tailored to the people being taught. At the time he was born the prevalent Hindu beliefs were in an eternal soul, reincarnation, and the caste system. These beliefs were specific impediments to the aim he was trying to teach people to achieve, so he modified or contradicted them in is teachings. Again, his aim was not to teach truth, but to teach how to see it (he was being a very good finger, instead of describing the moon).

4. There is therefore no reason to believe that belief in things such as rebirth etc is necessary for enlightenment. The people at the time of the Buddha believed in reincarnation of a soul, which directly prevented them from attaining realisation, so he taught them the modified version of "reincarnation without a permanent soul" which is rebirth. Had he been born in a Western country today, without a prevailing reincarnation belief, he wouldn't have added the rebirth doctrine - regardless of whether it is true or not. He would have maintained a Noble Silence on it - if it is true we will know when we attain enlightenment, and if it is false we will know when we attain enlightenment - just as he did 2,500 years ago on the questions that were irrelevant at the time. Today in the West he is more likely to have addressed whichever features of our current scientific worldview impinge on our ability to attain enlightenment.

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Reply from leoj99
May.28.2013
02:39AM EDT 
vertical line 1. The Buddha himself stated that he was teaching a method to train oneself to directly see knowledge/wisdom,not teaching the actual knowledge itself (hence the emphasis in Zen especially that conceptual understanding is dead understanding and that experience is the important thing. He was being a finger rather than describing the moon), and that the training method was useful only in as far as it led to this result (forget the finger and look at the moon, metaphor of the raft crossing the stream and then being abandoned etc).

What is conceptual understanding? ... Thinking isn't it?

Thinking is a dead understanding...lol

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152778
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Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
02:44AM EDT 
vertical line Many jewels in that treasure box.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152779
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Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
02:46AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "1. The Buddha himself stated that he was teaching a method to train oneself to directly see knowledge/wisdom,not teaching the actual knowledge itself (hence the emphasis in Zen especially that conceptual understanding is dead understanding and that experience is the important thing. He was being a finger rather than describing the moon), and that the training method was useful only in as far as it led to this result (forget the finger and look at the moon, metaphor of the raft crossing the stream and then being abandoned etc).

What is conceptual understanding? ... Thinking isn't it?

Thinking is a dead understanding...lol

"
.........

Useless teaching is dead teaching.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152780
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Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
02:51AM EDT 
vertical line The article is insightful. Where did you find it?
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152781
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Reply from leoj99
May.28.2013
02:54AM EDT 
vertical line In the other Zen Forum...lol
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152782
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Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
02:57AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "In the other Zen Forum...lol "
.........

Did you read the whole article with understanding?
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152783
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Reply from leoj99
May.28.2013
03:10AM EDT 
vertical line Yeah I read it already...
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152784
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Reply from leoj99
May.28.2013
04:01AM EDT 
vertical line That is why I copied it here...
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152785
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Reply from leoj99
May.28.2013
04:05AM EDT 
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He therefore had no need to disabuse people of their mistaken beliefs unless they directly prevented the attainment of realisation -

So he disabuse people of their mistaken beliefs if it directly prevented the attainment of realisation..
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152786
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Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
05:17AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "
He therefore had no need to disabuse people of their mistaken beliefs unless they directly prevented the attainment of realisation -

So he disabuse people of their mistaken beliefs if it directly prevented the attainment of realisation..
"
.........

Yes.
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Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
05:19AM EDT 
vertical line Like the mistaken belief that repeating "stop thinking" is ever going to do yourself or anyone else any good.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152788
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Reply from so_teh
May.29.2013
09:14PM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line 108 thoughts 1 mala
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152840
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Reply from football
May.30.2013
05:34AM EDT 
Email football
vertical line thought.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152858
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Reply from leoj99
Jun.01.2013
04:55PM EDT 
vertical line So anyone in this Forum really understand what the Buddha is teaching? ... lol

It seem everybody is saying ... I have no idea ....LOL
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152970
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Reply from leoj99
Jun.01.2013
04:58PM EDT 
vertical line But even if  you say.. I have an idea... lol

Any idea is no good...lol
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Reply from leoj99
Jun.01.2013
05:21PM EDT 
vertical line If any idea is not good ... so why ...many people .... cannot stop thinking?....
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152972
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