history principles practice stories, books, media discussion forum organizations resources
zenguide.com logo
 
Saturday Aug 30 2014 04:29AM ET
º login º register º email º guestbook º printer friendly
grey dot
  One day, Chang-sha Ching-tsen (d. 868), one of the well-known Chinese Ch'an masters,
wandered in the mountain. When he was back just at the gate of the temple, the head monk asked him:
-Where have you been, Sir?
Chang-sha replied:
-I... continue...

z
.
e
.
n
menu left history menu spacer principles menu spacer practice menu spacer zen media menu spacer discussion forum menu spacer organization directory menu spacer resources  
login
  DISCUSSION FORUM
» topic list   » start a new topic   » my tracked topics   » view topic
grey dot

horizontal line
→→→→ vertical line TOPIC: BE GOOD
vertical line Posted on May.28.2013 @ 08:15AM EDT by football
Can you?
Go to Latest Reply   Reply to this Topic   Email football
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from *CSEe*
May.28.2013
12:16PM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
vertical line

In my current understanding , the desire to " be good" , the will to " be good" is the pollutant that causes own existance .........Buddhism is a process freedom from all emotions / desire ..................BE AWAKE not by desire but with own realization.

thks

CSEe

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152789
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from football
May.28.2013
12:25PM EDT 
Email football
vertical line You are wrong...you will understand me when you become awake with your own realization.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152790
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
04:36PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "You are wrong...you will understand me when you become awake with your own realization."
.........

:-)
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152791
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from esoteric
May.28.2013
04:51PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

In my current understanding , the desire to " be good" , the will to " be good" is the pollutant that causes own existance .........Buddhism is a process freedom from all emotions / desire ..................BE AWAKE not by desire but with own realization.

thks

CSEe

"
.........

CSEe, I'm sorry to read that you still believe existence is caused by a pollutant, and that the pollutant is caused by yourself. That must be very unhappy for you.

However, I am encouraged by the fact that, despite this belief of yours that desire is a pollutant, you still have a desire to BE AWAKE. That's good, and if you're like me, that gives you a center of joy, comfort, and solidness through any unhappiness you may have.

EXISTENCE IS. No cause, no doing away with it.
DESIRES HAVE PURPOSE. When you see desire, find out what the purpose is.
BEING AWAKE is both pleasant and unpleasant. Because existence is filled with pleasant and unpleasant experience.
LIVING IN ACCEPTANCE of this brings HARMONY to it, so it is not suffering.

But don't take my word for it. Keep practicing, and keep looking!
KEEP LIVING. AND BE GOOD.

:-)
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152792
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from leoj99
May.29.2013
01:09AM EDT 
vertical line I think almost everybody thinks they are good.. too good for their own good .. and spoils them... that is why suffering is always there because of good people..lol
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152798
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from esoteric
May.29.2013
02:33AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "I think almost everybody thinks they are good.. too good for their own good .. and spoils them... that is why suffering is always there because of good people..lol "
.........

Is suffering good or bad?
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152800
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from leoj99
May.29.2013
02:50AM EDT 
vertical line What do you think?...LOL
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152803
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from *CSEe*
May.29.2013
03:18AM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
vertical line

Quote: "You are wrong...you will understand me when you become awake with your own realization."
.........

To me , if one have the idea on what is right or wrong ......he will always be in " himself" , enjoying the existance of " himself" and will always exist and continue to exist .....he will be in longer journey in his process towards emptiness .

Dear football , I will always learn from you and during my journey of learning there is no right or wrong as I always awake to aware , aware to realize , realize to accept , accept to further aware .......I do not choose my path base on my knowledge on right verses wrong .......I just living in my life awake .

Thks

CSEe

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152804
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from *CSEe*
May.29.2013
03:47AM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
vertical line

Dear esoteric , you said I quote " CSEe, I'm sorry to read that you still believe existence is caused by a pollutant, and that the pollutant is caused by yourself. That must be very unhappy for you." un-quote

Correction . To me the pollutant is myself NOT cause by myself but is MYSELF . In my current understanding , myself is consist of all my desire / emotions / fear / love / compassion / anger etc and this is the cause of my existance .

You said " However, I am encouraged by the fact that, despite this belief of yours that desire is a pollutant, you still have a desire to BE AWAKE. That's good, and if you're like me, that gives you a center of joy, comfort, and solidness through any unhappiness you may have." un-quote

Correction . I do not have beliefs or faith or DESIRE to be awake rather this is MYSELF right now , is what myself is , is my current realization with current condition .......and I more and more feel " lighter" ,' Less burden" and this is because perhaps I am less and less attached my emotions . My desire / emotions etc seems decreased and in this condition I feel " easy" ......

You said " EXISTENCE IS. No cause, no doing away with it."  un-quote

In my current understanding of Buddhism , existence is cause by pollutant / reason as living is perhaps cause by the will , the desire , the emotions and the non-living is cause by the nature .........


You said " DESIRES HAVE PURPOSE. When you see desire, find out what the purpose is." un-quote

The purpose is not important as the purpose of all desire is cause of other desire / emotions etc ......in my current understanding of Buddhism , desire is same as any other emotions , love or compassion and Buddhism is a NATURAL PROCESS leading to freedom of all of these pollutant into emptiness back into nothingness ...

So to me is not important to find out the cause , the purpose of desire but is to progress into it , realizing it , accept it , further to aware it and naturally it will free from it without having any intention to free from it .


You said " BEING AWAKE is both pleasant and unpleasant. Because existence is filled with pleasant and unpleasant experience." un-quote

I cant find any reason to agree with you on this . In my current understanding , there is no comparison in Buddhism , no pleasant or un-pleasant , no right or wrong etc ......Siddharta had explain all the answer , the question in Buddhism concept and that is all the explaination ......therefore if there is only one how could you compare ? All experiences is part of own process into emptiness not by choice so comparison does not apply in the Buddhism concept .


You said " LIVING IN ACCEPTANCE of this brings HARMONY to it, so it is not suffering
But don't take my word for it. Keep practicing, and keep looking!
KEEP LIVING. AND BE GOOD." un-quote

As human , by my culture your advice is great and I should be thankful to you ...but my friend in Buddhism ...........even harmony is the same as suffering .

Thks

CSEe

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152805
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from *CSEe*
May.29.2013
03:48AM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
vertical line

Quote: "Quote: "I think almost everybody thinks they are good.. too good for their own good .. and spoils them... that is why suffering is always there because of good people..lol "
.........

Is suffering good or bad?
"
.........

Is same as joy , love , compassion , desire , emotions , fear , will etc and there is no good or bad , no true or false and no right or wrong in Buddhism.

Thks

CSEe

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152806
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from leoj99
May.29.2013
04:46AM EDT 
vertical line No good or bad... no true or false...lol..
Where did you learn that crap...lol
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152807
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from esoteric
May.29.2013
05:24AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Dear esoteric , you said I quote " CSEe, I'm sorry to read that you still believe existence is caused by a pollutant, and that the pollutant is caused by yourself. That must be very unhappy for you." un-quote

Correction . To me the pollutant is myself NOT cause by myself but is MYSELF . In my current understanding , myself is consist of all my desire / emotions / fear / love / compassion / anger etc and this is the cause of my existance .

You said " However, I am encouraged by the fact that, despite this belief of yours that desire is a pollutant, you still have a desire to BE AWAKE. That's good, and if you're like me, that gives you a center of joy, comfort, and solidness through any unhappiness you may have." un-quote

Correction . I do not have beliefs or faith or DESIRE to be awake rather this is MYSELF right now , is what myself is , is my current realization with current condition .......and I more and more feel " lighter" ,' Less burden" and this is because perhaps I am less and less attached my emotions . My desire / emotions etc seems decreased and in this condition I feel " easy" ......

You said " EXISTENCE IS. No cause, no doing away with it."  un-quote

In my current understanding of Buddhism , existence is cause by pollutant / reason as living is perhaps cause by the will , the desire , the emotions and the non-living is cause by the nature .........


You said " DESIRES HAVE PURPOSE. When you see desire, find out what the purpose is." un-quote

The purpose is not important as the purpose of all desire is cause of other desire / emotions etc ......in my current understanding of Buddhism , desire is same as any other emotions , love or compassion and Buddhism is a NATURAL PROCESS leading to freedom of all of these pollutant into emptiness back into nothingness ...

So to me is not important to find out the cause , the purpose of desire but is to progress into it , realizing it , accept it , further to aware it and naturally it will free from it without having any intention to free from it .


You said " BEING AWAKE is both pleasant and unpleasant. Because existence is filled with pleasant and unpleasant experience." un-quote

I cant find any reason to agree with you on this . In my current understanding , there is no comparison in Buddhism , no pleasant or un-pleasant , no right or wrong etc ......Siddharta had explain all the answer , the question in Buddhism concept and that is all the explaination ......therefore if there is only one how could you compare ? All experiences is part of own process into emptiness not by choice so comparison does not apply in the Buddhism concept .


You said " LIVING IN ACCEPTANCE of this brings HARMONY to it, so it is not suffering
But don't take my word for it. Keep practicing, and keep looking!
KEEP LIVING. AND BE GOOD." un-quote

As human , by my culture your advice is great and I should be thankful to you ...but my friend in Buddhism ...........even harmony is the same as suffering .

Thks

CSEe

"
.........

So, you believe that your own existence is pollution, and that all of existence is pollution. Therefore, you believe that emptiness is the same as nothingness, so you believe that the answer to existence/consciousness/(suffering) is extinction/nothingness.

Sitting zazen, all of these beliefs go away entirely.

Drink tea. Empty your cup. Then go wash your cup.

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152809
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from football
May.29.2013
06:18AM EDT 
Email football
vertical line

Quote: "You are wrong...you will understand me when you become awake with your own realization."
.........

To me , if one have the idea on what is right or wrong ......he will always be in " himself" , enjoying the existance of " himself" and will always exist and continue to exist .....he will be in longer journey in his process towards emptiness .

Dear football , I will always learn from you and during my journey of learning there is no right or wrong as I always awake to aware , aware to realize , realize to accept , accept to further aware .......I do not choose my path base on my knowledge on right verses wrong .......I just living in my life awake .

Thks

CSEe

"
.........

"
.........

I wish you serenity life.

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152811
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from football
May.29.2013
06:23AM EDT 
Email football
vertical line

Quote: "Sitting zazen, all of these beliefs go away entirely.

Drink tea. Empty your cup. Then go wash your cup.
"
.........

esoteric, I think *CSEe* is coming towards us and you are going the other way towards forward. :)

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152812
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from *CSEe*
May.29.2013
09:11AM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
vertical line

Dear Esoteric , you said " So, you believe that your own existence is pollution, and that all of existence is pollution. " un-quote

Perhaps there is a differences here , my current understanding is my existance is caused by my will , my desire , my emotions etc that all these I known it as myself and myself is pollutant as in nothingness  . All existance is resulted from this pollutant and the existant itself it is pollutant against nothingness .....

you said , I quote " Therefore, you believe that emptiness is the same as nothingness, so you believe that the answer to existence/consciousness/(suffering) is extinction/nothingness." Un-quote

Perhaps there is again some mis-understanding here . My current view is emptiness is a condition resulted from a process of emptying / releasing polluted energy and nothingness is a condition freedom of all ......the answer of existance / suffering is NOT extinction  or nothingness . Buddhism is the answer to all question even reason to answer or reason to question .

You said , I quote " Sitting zazen, all of these beliefs go away entirely." Un-quote

Perhaps in my current view , the emotion to dis-believe , the desire to enjoy the condition , the beliefs base on own experiences is actually taking longer journey into freedom of self .......dear esoteric , in my current understanding , Buddhism is not an answering machine or a way to get out but is the only truth .........so in Buddhism is more to explore your reason to sit , the desire to sit , the emotion while sitting perhaps not much on your expectation after sit.........................


You said , I quote " Drink tea. Empty your cup. Then go wash your cup." Un-quote

Perhaps as I progress , I realize there was never a cup ...is always the pollutant that
I hold on ..........Buddhism is to let it go..........dear esoteric , very sorry in advance have you come across your mind perhaps is your cup already full and overflow ?

Buddhism to me currently is all about learning NEVER teaching .............so I am learning from all to explore myself .

Thks

CSEe

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152813
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from *CSEe*
May.29.2013
09:12AM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
vertical line Quote: "

Quote: "You are wrong...you will understand me when you become awake with your own realization."
.........

To me , if one have the idea on what is right or wrong ......he will always be in " himself" , enjoying the existance of " himself" and will always exist and continue to exist .....he will be in longer journey in his process towards emptiness .

Dear football , I will always learn from you and during my journey of learning there is no right or wrong as I always awake to aware , aware to realize , realize to accept , accept to further aware .......I do not choose my path base on my knowledge on right verses wrong .......I just living in my life awake .

Thks

CSEe

"
.........

"
.........

I wish you serenity life.

"

"

Thanks sir

CSEe
.........

vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152814
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from esoteric
May.29.2013
10:13AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Quote: "Sitting zazen, all of these beliefs go away entirely.

Drink tea. Empty your cup. Then go wash your cup.
"
.........

esoteric, I think *CSEe* is coming towards us and you are going the other way towards forward. :)

"
.........

Nah, we're just talking together, like we do. :-)
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152816
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from esoteric
May.29.2013
10:15AM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "

Perhaps as I progress , I realize there was never a cup ...is always the pollutant that
I hold on ..........Buddhism is to let it go..........dear esoteric , very sorry in advance have you come across your mind perhaps is your cup already full and overflow ?

Buddhism to me currently is all about learning NEVER teaching .............so I am learning from all to explore myself .

Thks

CSEe

"
.........

STORIES, BOOKS & MEDIA
» koans, stories & words   » zen readings   » recommended books   » book reviews   » art & prints   » audio, videos, DVD's
grey dot

HAPPY CHINAMAN OR LAUGHING BUDDHA
Anyone walking about Chinatowns in America with observe statues of a stout fellow carrying a linen sack. Chinese merchants call him Happy Chinaman or Laughing Buddha.

This Hotei lived in the T'ang dynasty. He had no desire to call himself a Zen master or to gather many disciples about him. Instead he walked the streets with a big sack into which he would put gifts of candy, fruit, or doughnuts. These he would give to children who gathered around him in play. He established a kindergarten of the streets.

Whenever he met a Zen devotee he would extend his hand and say: "Give me one penny." And if anyone asked him to return to a temple to teach others, again he would reply: "Give me one penny."

Once he was about his play-work another Zen master happened along and inquired: "What is the significance of Zen?"

Hotei immediately plopped his sack down on the ground in silent answer.

"Then," asked the other, "what is the actualization of Zen?"

At once the Happy Chinaman swung the sack over his shoulder and continued on his way.

Muju


vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152817
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from football
May.29.2013
03:31PM EDT 
Email football
vertical line If there is Nothing Holy what are we talking about?
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152823
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from football
May.29.2013
05:25PM EDT 
Email football
vertical line The nun Soji
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152825
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from esoteric
May.29.2013
05:53PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "If there is Nothing Holy what are we talking about?"
.........

Ending suffering.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152827
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from so_teh
May.29.2013
09:13PM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line Good god.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152839
horizontal line
 
horizontal line
Reply from Joe Chip
May.30.2013
08:15AM EDT 
vertical line Jebus - if you can't be good, be careful you don't handle inside the box.
vertical line Quote & Reply   Post Reply 152869
horizontal line
 
Back To Topic List   Go to Top of Page

 



SUPPORT ZENGUIDE.COM
If you are planning on purchasing any product from amazon.com, you can help us out by using the search box to the right or by clicking on this link to begin shopping.


Purchase posters, art prints, media (music CD & DVD)

buy this TIBETAN BUDDHA
by
Puchase this Item
More Art Prints & Media
Zen & Buddhism books
 
 
d
.
i
.
s
.
c
.
u
.
s
.
s
.
i
.
o
.
n
.

.
f
.
o
.
r
.
u
.
m
.
Copyright © 1999 - 2014 zenguide.com - All rights reserved. °