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  When Yang-shan Hui-chi (807-883), as a young monk, paid a visit to the Ch'an master
Hsing-k'ung, there was a monk who asked Hsing-k'ung:
-What is the meaning of the Patriarch's coming from the West?
Hsing-k'ung replied:
-Suppose... continue...

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→→→→ vertical line TOPIC: ZEN IS BUDDHISM AND TAOISM COMBINED, EVOLVED
vertical line Posted on Aug.22.2013 @ 12:16PM EDT by ovlyvion
Zen was created when Bodhidharma, an enlightened Buddhist master, traveled to China on the order of his master, who according to Osho was an enlightened woman. She initiated him.

There, Bodhidharma encountered Taoists, and Taoism and Buddhism merged and became Zen. The word "Zen" comes originally from Sanskrit "dhyana," which means "meditation." After reaching China, "dhyana" became "chan" which in Japan became "Zen." "Zen" also means the whole, everything; it's synonymous with "tao" which also means the whole, and also means meditation.

Buddhism is corrupt and unevolved Zen. This is why I have started this topic, I want as many sannyasins (this means "seekers") to realize what Buddhism is. Zen should not be called "Zen Buddhism;" it's a totally different animal, it has nothing to do with Buddhism, no more than a snake has anything to do with its discarded skin.

Buddha was repressive. He told his disciples never to even look at women. Even Bodhidharma was more evolved; when asked how lay people could achieve enlightenment if they still indulge in sex, he replied "I do not speak to you of sex. When your meditation is as deep as possible, sex is simply immaterial." This means "don't bother about sex one way or another; meditation is the correct path, and it will lead you beyond sex." Buddha was afraid to allow women into his order because it might make people stop practicing celibacy. Bodhidharma was, on the other hand, according to Osho, ordained by an enlightened woman. He was not afraid.

Buddha says the good has to be expressed and the evil has to be repressed. This is a subtle violence against yourself and the whole universe. Taoism is not violent that I can see, and certainly not in this way; nothing is to be repressed. Everything inside and outside is perfectly OK no matter what. So someone is doing "evil," so what? "When people see some things as good, other things become bad" is quite clear. Also "Throw away morality and justice, and people will do the right thing."

Buddhism has to be thrown away like garbage, all its scriptures should be burned. And Zen has to lose the attitude that it's a Buddhist sect, and lose the name "Zen Buddhism;" Zen is higher than Buddhism, far higher.

Buddha also created many rules for his disciples and future followers, a code of conduct, a discipline, a dogma, a doctrine, a morality. Taoism knows no discipline, no rules, no code of conduct, no dogma, no doctrine, no morality. And Zen certainly knows none of these things.

Buddhism is the lowest, Taoism is higher, and Zen is highest. A higher religion than Zen is impossible.
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Reply from football
Aug.22.2013
04:09PM EDT 
Email football
vertical line Good days are there for the 2nd Patriarch not for Bodhidharma. 
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Reply from Avisitor
Aug.22.2013
06:26PM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line Another one has sprouted .... hahaha
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Reply from Avisitor
Aug.22.2013
06:32PM EDT 
Email Avisitor
vertical line Do you have a teacher?
Do you practice Zazen?
Do you have a sangha?

If you know what Zen is then you understand it is not about saying what Zen is or is not.
It is about practice and awakening.
Everything else is just more stuff.

.... Hahahaha
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Reply from so_teh
Aug.22.2013
07:20PM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line You have to just reach in and extract the everyday mind. You should also be centered in balance and in time. And open yourself to the fullness of life and love.
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Reply from ovlyvion
Aug.22.2013
09:58PM EDT 
vertical line Quote: "Do you have a teacher?
Do you practice Zazen?
Do you have a sangha?

If you know what Zen is then you understand it is not about saying what Zen is or is not.
It is about practice and awakening.
Everything else is just more stuff.

.... Hahahaha
"
.........

I'm replying to this and other people. You don't understand, my purpose is to reunify Buddhism, Taoism and Zen, and to eliminate Buddhism and Taoism from the world, leaving only Zen (and Rajneeshism). By making people aware of the situation, this can be achieved.

It has nothing to do with meditation or achieving enlightenment. It has to do with cleaning the corruption that has infested meditative religions.

In my experience, Zen practitioners IRL are more humble and authentic than Buddhists. The Buddhists seem to be fascist, confused, egomaniacal idiots. Buddhist monks are dead, or just foolish. And how many Buddhist monks have been enlightened throughout history? How many Zen monks? There are not many. =\

Monks may become gay from being forced to practice celibacy, or from being around only men all the time. Same for nuns. Monasteries should be replaced by communes, and either way the place should be co-ed, and the idea that celibacy should be practiced should be abolished. It cannot be practiced, it arises spontaneously. So I would like to eliminate celibacy and gender separation in monasteries, and replace monasteries with communes.

If the new man does not spread across the Earth like wildfire, there is a danger that humanity may be finished by nuclear war, the death of the ecosystem, overpopulation, climate change, or limited resources.

I don't see what is so difficult to understand about what I am saying, but if you are lecturing me about meditation, you have certainly not understood.
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Reply from ovlyvion
Aug.22.2013
10:00PM EDT 
vertical line Also it's none of your business whether or not I have a "teacher" or "have a sanga," neither of these is needed necessarily, especially not a sanga. I am more or less confident in my ability to reach enlightenment alone through meditation. It's worked so far, so I don't see why it shouldn't work till the end. I may be wrong, perhaps I need a master; I have heard that only one in a million enlighten without a master, but this may also be false.

I am doing fine.
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Reply from ovlyvion
Aug.22.2013
10:05PM EDT 
vertical line I am sorry for triple posting, but there is no apparent edit function so I think it is appropriate.

It is our responsibility to humanity to end corruption in meditative religions. All that is needed is to spread the truth, make people aware of it.

And avisitor, you are assuming that I don't have a teacher, don't have a sanga, and don't sit in zazen, based solely on my opinion and decision to share it. And my opinion is right. You are an idiot.
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Reply from *CSEe*
Aug.22.2013
10:05PM EDT 
Email *CSEe*
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Perhaps not . Perhaps you are using your knowledge and make judgement on what you know and what you had learn.......perhaps Buddhism is beyond that ....Perhaps Buddhism is you in your own journey to discover you and yourself .....perhaps now you are travelling longer journey into discovering yourself yet this is still part of your learning lesson .

I hoping to debate with you base on your understanding against mine for my own learning lesson .....

Thks

CSEe

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Reply from the alan
Aug.22.2013
10:10PM EDT 
Email the alan
vertical line Quote: "I am sorry for triple posting, but there is no apparent edit function so I think it is appropriate.

It is our responsibility to humanity to end corruption in meditative religions. All that is needed is to spread the truth, make people aware of it.

And avisitor, you are assuming that I don't have a teacher, don't have a sanga, and don't sit in zazen, based solely on my opinion and decision to share it. And my opinion is right. You are an idiot.
"
.........

There's no edit function because you should really think before posting something. This isn't your every day "zen" forum. If you had to pull your mental trigger 3 times, you should be better at your aim.

You just joined and already violated the first rule: personal attack. Either follow the rules or find another forum. I have very low tolerance for blatant personal attacks.

Al
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Reply from ovlyvion
Aug.22.2013
10:35PM EDT 
vertical line It's not a personal attack, it's a true statement. Osho has called people idiots and "confirmed retarded" many times and he was an enlightened master.

And "thinking before you post" is not necessary. That is why the edit function exists. It's best to just let the bodymind naturally do whatever it wants. This forum is antediluvian for not having an edit function, and you certainly can't blame me for the dysfunction it causes. =p

If someone is an idiot, they should be called an idiot, it hurts their ego, which is a benefit, and it exposes them. Those who commit injustice should always be exposed, and injustice should never be taken without complaint. The enemies of truth should be treated as what they are and told what they are.

It's more barbaric to ban someone for calling someone an idiot than to call someone else an idiot. Calling someone an idiot is a statement, it can be true or false, banning someone is violence. It should only be done to spammers, bots, and maybe people who are here only to disrupt, nothing else, and cannot be helped.

The internet is a childish place full of childish people, and meditative communities are no exception. Having so many rules about conduct is childish, and the rules are wrong. There is nothing wrong with calling someone an idiot. >=p
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Reply from ovlyvion
Aug.22.2013
10:37PM EDT 
vertical line Also, maybe you didn't notice, but avisitor was personally attacking me? And what he said was false and childish.
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Reply from so_teh
Aug.22.2013
10:44PM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line You are You, Zen is Zen.

O so simple.

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Reply from ovlyvion
Aug.22.2013
10:58PM EDT 
vertical line Sit-teh, I understand Zen as far as is needed to meditate and reach enlightenment. This topic is not a question, nor is it a sign of any kind of confusion about Zen. I'm trying to make people aware of the problems with meditative religions so that those problems will disappear.

All this drama over calling someone an idiot. So what if I call someone an idiot? It's just a word, it's not poison. Have some maturity. (This isn't directed at you Sit-teh :)

And avisitor, I meditate for at least 3 hours a day, I have a master, and this is a sanga, and it's not "my" only sanga. =p
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Reply from so_teh
Aug.22.2013
11:08PM EDT 
Email so_teh
vertical line Okay, then.

Take Care :)
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Reply from leoj99
Aug.22.2013
11:15PM EDT 
vertical line Are those  your words or somebody else's words?.. What do you expect us to do about it.. just swallow  your words ... or believe your woreds...?  LOL
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Reply from the alan
Aug.22.2013
11:32PM EDT 
Email the alan
vertical line Quote: "It's not a personal attack, it's a true statement. Osho has called people idiots and "confirmed retarded" many times and he was an enlightened master.

And "thinking before you post" is not necessary. That is why the edit function exists. It's best to just let the bodymind naturally do whatever it wants. This forum is antediluvian for not having an edit function, and you certainly can't blame me for the dysfunction it causes. =p

If someone is an idiot, they should be called an idiot, it hurts their ego, which is a benefit, and it exposes them. Those who commit injustice should always be exposed, and injustice should never be taken without complaint. The enemies of truth should be treated as what they are and told what they are.

It's more barbaric to ban someone for calling someone an idiot than to call someone else an idiot. Calling someone an idiot is a statement, it can be true or false, banning someone is violence. It should only be done to spammers, bots, and maybe people who are here only to disrupt, nothing else, and cannot be helped.

The internet is a childish place full of childish people, and meditative communities are no exception. Having so many rules about conduct is childish, and the rules are wrong. There is nothing wrong with calling someone an idiot. >=p
"
.........

Not in my house. Do that elsewhere. Bye!

Al
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